My First Bass Guitar

Al_Nico said:

ICBM said:

PhilKing said:

My 63 Thunderbird has a much better bridge/tailpiece set up.  I don't know why Gibson didn't use it more

Yes - a far better arrangement. You can actually fix the appalling type by simply adding that sort of stopbar and using the original tailpiece just as a bridge, but of course that involves drilling some big holes in the body. Still worth it.

Sorry. Missed that. That's one vote in favour :)

Another vote from me

It's not easy this bass guitar thing at all.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/b1ty3m46gona1lx0fqpic/slap1.mp3?rlkey=toukc86jrotrfehnmec9nqxw8&st=1us1nh35&raw=1

OilCityPickups said:

Another vote from me

Ok. Great. Thanks.

It seems to be difficult to find a screw-down bass string anchor that isn’t a full stopbar tailpiece and involve drilling accurately for post inserts.

Surprisingly, by far the cheapest and easiest solution - although it will look a bit odd - would be just to get a Fender-style folded steel bridge and remove the saddles.

Al_Nico said:

I notice on the real thing the strap lock is above the 17th fret but the HB is above the 20th fret, about 2" further back.

I've made a comparable image and in doing so discovered a potential flight case to use when invited to perform on world tours and international music festivals.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ntqebud3vgkuq93pe6zfq/caseshot.jpg?rlkey=rf4a4vi0x61zyys9ok6eu5uwz&st=xw1matfq&raw=1

Another obvious QA issue with the HB is it has been accidently fitted with a left handed neck.

That's because the neck goes much further into the body, which is why the stop is at the end of the body.  Adding a stop will help with the balance of your bass.

ICBM said:

It seems to be difficult to find a screw-down bass string anchor that isn’t a full stopbar tailpiece and involve drilling accurately for post inserts.

Surprisingly, by far the cheapest and easiest solution - although it will look a bit odd - would be just to get a Fender-style folded steel bridge and remove the saddles.

I like your thinking. I have looked to see which others could be used. The bridge posts look wider than fender bridge so might have a couple of holes left showing?

Will sleep on it and probably end up fixing it up the way it was designed and let you all down :)

Al_Nico said:

I like your thinking. I have looked to see which others could be used. The bridge posts look wider than fender bridge so might have a couple of holes left showing?

Will sleep on it and probably end up fixing it up the way it was designed and let you all down :)

I meant adding the base of the Fender bridge to the existing arrangement, so the Gibson bridge becomes just a bridge. That will stop it trying to pull the rear anchors out and move the string overwrap well back from the saddles.

It might actually look less odd with the Fender bridge mounted backwards.

You can get some really nice proper replacement bridges that fit the original post holes - Hipshot or Babicz - but unfortunately they cost about as much as the bass...

https://www.gluedtomusic.com/products/581/hipshot-supertone-bass-bridge-gibson-3-point-style-black/

https://www.gluedtomusic.com/products/1381/babicz-fch-3-original-series-gibson-3-point-style-bass-bridge-black/

ICBM said:

Al_Nico said:

I like your thinking. I have looked to see which others could be used. The bridge posts look wider than fender bridge so might have a couple of holes left showing?

Will sleep on it and probably end up fixing it up the way it was designed and let you all down :)

I meant adding the base of the Fender bridge to the existing arrangement, so the Gibson bridge becomes just a bridge. That will stop it trying to pull the rear anchors out and move the string overwrap well back from the saddles.

It might actually look less odd with the Fender bridge mounted backwards.

You can get some really nice proper replacement bridges that fit the original post holes - Hipshot or Babicz - but unfortunately they cost about as much as the bass...

https://www.gluedtomusic.com/products/581/hipshot-supertone-bass-bridge-gibson-3-point-style-black/

https://www.gluedtomusic.com/products/1381/babicz-fch-3-original-series-gibson-3-point-style-bass-bridge-black/

It's certainly a solution. I did look at those two bridges. They are in fact twice the price of the instrument :) And...they look to me like they don't solve the string resting on it's wind offs issue, if it is one. The individual string height adjustment is appealing tho.

Another option is through body. I've seen pics of older basses with this and the ferrules on the front have pulled through the wood a bit. I like the idea but would need a one piece plate and ferrules on the front so it cant distort. I can't find anything like this tho? There may be a patent still available for this design?

Al_Nico said:

Another option is through body. I've seen pics of older basses with this and the ferrules on the front have pulled through the wood a bit. I like the idea but would need a one piece plate and ferrules on the front so it cant distort. I can't find anything like this tho? There may be a patent still available for this design?

If you drill through directly under the current ball end positions you won't need ferrules on the front, as the strings will then exit at a right angle and the holes will be hidden by the bridge.

However, this is tricky to do well - even with a pillar drill, the drill bit going through the body tends to 'wander' slightly so the ferrules on the back end up not quite perfectly aligned and look a mess. (This actually happened on early Fenders.) To do it, you're best to drill one hole first, mark the other three on the back correctly using that as the reference and half-drill through from the back, then finally drill those three from the front so the drill finds the existing hole.

Remember you also may then need extra-long-scale strings, or the silk windings at the headstock end will end up over the nut. (Or use strings with no silk.)

Hipshot also make a two piece bridge/tailpiece but again the price is high:

https://hipshotproducts.com/collections/bass-bridges/products/4-string-d-style-bass-bridge

ICBM said:

Al_Nico said:

Another option is through body. I've seen pics of older basses with this and the ferrules on the front have pulled through the wood a bit. I like the idea but would need a one piece plate and ferrules on the front so it cant distort. I can't find anything like this tho? There may be a patent still available for this design?

If you drill through directly under the current ball end positions you won't need ferrules on the front, as the strings will then exit at a right angle and the holes will be hidden by the bridge.

However, this is tricky to do well - even with a pillar drill, the drill bit going through the body tends to 'wander' slightly so the ferrules on the back end up not quite perfectly aligned and look a mess. (This actually happened on early Fenders.) To do it, you're best to drill one hole first, mark the other three on the back correctly using that as the reference and half-drill through from the back, then finally drill those three from the front so the drill finds the existing hole.

Remember you also may then need extra-long-scale strings, or the silk windings at the headstock end will end up over the nut. (Or use strings with no silk.)

Ah yeah Good thinking. Closer to the bridge. I was imagining maybe angling the holes so there is not too much stress on the holes adding further challenges to the operation. Close will make them go straight up as you say. Mmm. Interesting.

I've seen Shaun from Scarred Guitars add some through body holes with an electric hand drill and sure enough, the back gets wonky ferrules. He doesn't care, it's on the back, but despite my dreadful launch into this with a file to the saddles, I promise I'm not normally so silly, I think.

My mate is one of those engineer types. If I ask him to help, he will either decline on a technical basis, or it will be to British Aerospace spec, and take a lot lot longer than expected with risk assessments.

PhilKing said:

Hipshot also make a two piece bridge/tailpiece but again the price is high:

https://hipshotproducts.com/collections/bass-bridges/products/4-string-d-style-bass-bridge

Good find but get the price on that. The tail piece can be purchased separately except it's $105.00 and that gives me anxiety.

Thanks for sharing. I should get the bridge today. I can feel I'm going to take the easy option first and replace as is with a bit of glue on the studs, then see if there are any issues I can't live with and re-think.

Personally I'd bung a high mass Precision bass unit on there and end all the troubles in one go 

Off to collect Vernier and feeler gauges.

This is going to be nothing short of precision engineering :)

OilCityPickups said:

Personally I'd bung a high mass Precision bass unit on there and end all the troubles in one go 

Blimey. That should do it. I think I'll end up with the back post holes showing? When I cut the groves in the saddles my theory was to use the same file size as the string so it sat tight in the saddle. This doesn't work. Two of the strings buzz in the slot and I notice on this bridge the saddles are very purposely V shaped. Every day's a school day.

Also, I've been watching people on the tube setting up basses. One bloke said he'd been doing it for over 40 years but adjusted the truss rod straighter with the strings at full tension. This is very practical to quickly see what effect adjustment has made. I'd be ok to release with string tension but is it ok to add tension?

Al_Nico said:

OilCityPickups said:

Personally I'd bung a high mass Precision bass unit on there and end all the troubles in one go 

Blimey. That should do it. I think I'll end up with the back post holes showing? When I cut the groves in the saddles my theory was to use the same file size as the string so it sat tight in the saddle. This doesn't work. Two of the strings buzz in the slot and I notice on this bridge the saddles are very purposely V shaped. Every day's a school day.

Also, I've been watching people on the tube setting up basses. One bloke said he'd been doing it for over 40 years but adjusted the truss rod straighter with the strings at full tension. This is very practical to quickly see what effect adjustment has made. I'd be ok to release with string tension but is it ok to add tension?

With string tension on, I tend to do the rickenbacker recommend thing of "bending" or shall we say carefully putting pressure on the neck to "straighten" it manually, with say your knee behind the neck, then adjust the truss rod nut, so the TR isn't doing all the work

ps, I'd also just bung one of those bridges on it as suggested by OilCityPickups and have done with it :) 

PeteBo said:

Al_Nico said:

OilCityPickups said:

Personally I'd bung a high mass Precision bass unit on there and end all the troubles in one go 

Blimey. That should do it. I think I'll end up with the back post holes showing? When I cut the groves in the saddles my theory was to use the same file size as the string so it sat tight in the saddle. This doesn't work. Two of the strings buzz in the slot and I notice on this bridge the saddles are very purposely V shaped. Every day's a school day.

Also, I've been watching people on the tube setting up basses. One bloke said he'd been doing it for over 40 years but adjusted the truss rod straighter with the strings at full tension. This is very practical to quickly see what effect adjustment has made. I'd be ok to release with string tension but is it ok to add tension?

With string tension on, I tend to do the rickenbacker recommend thing of "bending" or shall we say carefully putting pressure on the neck to "straighten" it manually, with say your knee behind the neck, then adjust the truss rod nut, so the TR isn't doing all the work

ps, I'd also just bung one of those bridges on it as suggested by OilCityPickups and have done with it :) 

Yep With a bass I always 'help' the truss rod.

Oh and although that's a Hipshot High mass Precision Bass bridge ... which is a tad pricey at about £85.00 there are high mass ones in black from £20 upwards online ... just pick a nice long one so as you can position it to cover the existing mounting holes (hopefully) ... oh and you woll probably need to extend the bridge earth wire which will be in one of the existing ferule holes so it can be jammed under the new P Bass bridge.  

PeteBo said:

With string tension on, I tend to do the rickenbacker recommend thing of "bending" or shall we say carefully putting pressure on the neck to "straighten" it manually, with say your knee behind the neck, then adjust the truss rod nut, so the TR isn't doing all the work

ps, I'd also just bung one of those bridges on it as suggested by OilCityPickups and have done with it :) 

Understood. Thanks. I can work like that, us musos should have a bit of feel for these things - crack :)

OilCityPickups said:

Yep With a bass I always 'help' the truss rod.

Oh and although that's a Hipshot High mass Precision Bass bridge ... which is a tad pricey at about £85.00 there are high mass ones in black from £20 upwards online ... just pick a nice long one so as you can position it to cover the existing mounting holes (hopefully) ... oh and you woll probably need to extend the bridge earth wire which will be in one of the existing ferule holes so it can be jammed under the new P Bass bridge.  

Thanks gents. I appreciate your feedback. I am coming round to these HIgh Mass things. The name is good. Boasting my bridge has a High Mass upgrade will make the machine special, my signature model.

I've got my Vernier and feeler gauges so will take some measurements, do some technical research. Well, I will when I get a microscopic pozi to open the Vernier battery compartment. Always something.

Aw. those High Mass bridges won't lift the strings high enough. Need another 3mm to set a low action. Oh well. I like the Gibson bridge too, it's retro cool :)

I will fix it with the standard bridge. I suspect the studs rises up because the bolt bottoms out early. Seems a fair method to use a longer bolts to remove the studs, saves needing to protect the paint unlike the plastic tube, washer and bolt removal method.

I'll drill the post holes to accommodate full length of the bolts so it can't force the studs out and that is probably all that needs doing to make it all work again.

Hello. My Bass is fixed.

I found that the screws were not forcing the stud out, it was pulling out under tension so I decided to shim the hole and make it tight and leave the other 2 as they haven't moved. I finished cutting the nut, straightened the neck a bit to good adjustment and set the bridge.

A huge difference in feel at the nut end now the strings are closer to the frets, much easier. Action at the top is good. Any closer and it starts to buzz but it isn't high, the strings tap against the frets with less effort. Not sure what to expect really but I'm happy. It feels playable.

Here's my method for stud removal from solid body guitars.
https://youtu.be/fTmfvOjGHVw

The hole was shimmed with a folded medium thickness cigarette paper.
Body and neck washed with liquid hand soap and water.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/wvj5lf2gr5pswnmm3r6ri/collage1.jpg?rlkey=0x2rijit4xv7fbyrja47tco1l&st=85yvecmr&raw=1

Frets polished.
Reassembly and string up.
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/zgr6yiward1mcqv3k4a37/collage2.jpg?rlkey=e63o801s48ajxod833kqtkpa5&st=0364db9v&raw=1

All new again.

HI. I have been fettling the setup. I had a buzz on fret 1 and action a bit high at the body.

So I moved from setup by feel and eye, looked at measurements. It needed a 1/4 turn relief on the truss rod to get 0.38mm bow.

The bridge is now in a comfy place and lower action. Takes a lot of fidgeting about for something so simple and have to protect the coating from metal tools.

Black hardware doesn't conduct electricity. My strings were left perfectly electrically isolated from ground. Had to file bits of coating off and spin the bolts with emery. Managed to keep it hidden.

Using just the front pickup it has a deep hollow sound but with bags of sustain. Both pickups on pulls the mid range down. It makes good popping sounds and plenty character.

I'll post some recording of bass only soon.

I've been practicing along with Time of My Life from Dirty Dancing because it makes me use three plucking fingers.
Now I have a blister on my 'a'.



Great song tho. Here's the backing track I use. Ignore the clicks. If you work out the notes for the two transition bars, I'd be grateful if you share them.

The Time Of My Life Dirty Dancing Backing Track No Bass With Vocals

https://youtu.be/0mPMkMlqJ0k